I still and will continue to run with the CCG whenever I am able to. I have keys for both SBHQ and CBHQ, so getting a toon there to participate is not the problem for me. Its the timing of the runs and my RL schedule. Even though there are more runs everyday, I'm still only able to make one complete run per night at best.

I personally still have many toons needing attention before they can go back to visit the VP and CFO. So if I spend all my playing time going to CCG runs with keyed toons, then obviously I'll never be able to have any other toons ready to promo. With that said, I try to make a run a night (more if time permitting) and spend the rest of the time attempting to get merits and bux.

Another thing that hit me in your post Lady Di was the part about lots of failed runs lately. I think Pink hit the heart of the issue as well. It seems everyone is jumping on the uberdom bandwagon. Originally, ubers were low laff big gagged toons. Nowadays, I see many "ubers" that intro their toon in VP before having their gags developed sufficiently to where they can hold their own in battle. This in turn causes alot of pressure on the rest of the VP team to carry that toon through. Another thing is knowing the "math" with respect to killing cogs. With limited amount of gags, an uber cannot afford to waste gags and passing when your firepower is not necessary for that kill is essential in preserving gags for bigger cogs. Most of the more successful ubers are (the majority of the time) the ones with the savy (and lots of luck) to survive a tough battle either by being able to carry their share of the load or have the presence of mind to play smart as an uber. Since we have so many playing "ubers" now, those that are playing their ubers need to better evaluate a load to determine if there is even a reasonable chance that the team will be able to make it before hopping on. How many times recently have an entire group gone sad because there were too many anxious ubers on board.

When I bring my uber to a CCG VP, I make sure to survey the pit to see just how many ubers there are before I decide to play mine. For me, it has nothing to do with me not wanting to go sad, my concern is for the rest of the team in case I or another uber happens to go sad. Sure I like to win just as much as the next guy, but in the event I don't, I surely like for my teammates to have a chance at winning dispite my going sad. So when there are lots of ubers in the pit, I end up switching to one of my big toons to help out.

Oh, and lastly, anyone playing an uber toon that expects to win everytime should really consider growing that toon instead. True ubers realize what a challange it is and accept the probability that he/she will go sad but do it for the sport of it.

Oh yay!! An uber discussion. I've really been wanting one lately, since I share many of the same thoughts. We have an overload of ubers, and running one myself has made it very difficult. Like Nunya said, no one wants to get there uber on board with a bunch of other ubers (we have uber VP for that) and it happens so often. I too have found that if I do happen to take Some on a reg. CCG VP run, that I have to hesitate because I don't want to get on board and see 5 other ubers next to me. It's become really tricky. Plus we do have many wannabee ubers, which is fine if a smart player is behind them, but many are not, lol! If I'm in a battle with another uber on my side, I'm assuming they have the skill down, and battle strategies, so I may make a move depending on them to play smart as well, only to be let down because of a bad move like killing a small cog instead of helping the team concentrate on one, ect ect.
Another point is ubers looking to win every time. I take Some and still can easily die on a street fight with a few cogs joining in. Ubers are meant to be risky to play, and with that risk comes trips back to the playground. Our uber VPs are often a trip back to playground, then a rematch win. But I have to admit I get down to see any uber go sad, I have a hard time getting used to any toons going sad other then my own toons.

Awesome post you guys! Geez I think we need to break this away into a new thread! Going to comment below..

nunyadambusiness :

Another thing that hit me in your post Lady Di was the part about lots of failed runs lately. I think Pink hit the heart of the issue as well. It seems everyone is jumping on the uberdom bandwagon. Originally, ubers were low laff big gagged toons. Nowadays, I see many "ubers" that intro their toon in VP before having their gags developed sufficiently to where they can hold their own in battle. This in turn causes alot of pressure on the rest of the VP team to carry that toon through. Another thing is knowing the "math" with respect to killing cogs. With limited amount of gags, an uber cannot afford to waste gags and passing when your firepower is not necessary for that kill is essential in preserving gags for bigger cogs.

I have to agree with you here.. The 3 ubers that I brought up through the CCG I made sure that I at least had level 5 gags before I started doing runs. Two of the most important gags to me have always been toonup and lure because they can make or break a team when you end up sided with other lower laff toons. There have been many times on my ubers that I have been the only one with good lure and had others go sad around me because someone on the team didn't have toonup. I hate when it comes down to choosing to toonup others up or lure in those big cogs!
Also one of the main reasons I never made a 25 laff super-noob was because I couldn't see myself choosing between sound and toonup. Sound helps you out in the factory but is pretty much useless on CCG runs.

nunyadambusiness :

Since we have so many playing "ubers" now, those that are playing their ubers need to better evaluate a load to determine if there is even a reasonable chance that the team will be able to make it before hopping on. How many times recently have an entire group gone sad because there were too many anxious ubers on board. When I bring my uber to a CCG VP, I make sure to survey the pit to see just how many ubers there are before I decide to play mine So when there are lots of ubers in the pit, I end up switching to one of my big toons to help out.

Really like what you said here! The best time to evaulate the amount of ubers present is in the pit and not when you get into the lobby. I have seen many members say to see who is loading in the elevator once you get in the lobby as far as ubers but if you do this you will have others thinking you are refusing to load. As soon as I walk through the doors in the lobby I load up and don't look at suits/names. To play any other way just doesnt seem the CCG way to me.

Some Granny Pickles :

Ubers are meant to be risky to play, and with that risk comes trips back to the playground. Our uber VPs are often a trip back to playground, then a rematch win. But I have to admit I get down to see any uber go sad, I have a hard time getting used to any toons going sad other then my own toons.

ITA with you on this Granny! That is why I say that playing ubers needs to be for someone who has some TT experience. I can't imagine my ubers being my first toon in this game. Can you imagine how imagine how upsetting it would be as someone new to TT and having a hard time winning the VP? The experience that I have in this game has also saved my ubers many times when it comes to running into griefers. Back in the days when the factory was hard and I was doing merits on my ubers I sent my share of high laff griefers back to the PG sad..

Here is a good example of what we are talking about. Here is a a comment I found on TTC by one of the new ubers..

I'm 22 laffs, cream pie and hose and I died a total of 5 V.P.'s.WUT DID I DO?!I'm..I'm...not cared for!!WAHH!!!Can some1 tell me something I could do?(besides laff boost that's all I can think of....)

I saw that post and since there was NOTHING positive that I could offer, I chose to keep my mouth shut. Sure wouldn't want a someone editing my post again.

I mean...let's be real, would it be reasonable for a 22 laffer to expect to get very far in VP? The CCG is great, but we are not miracle workers. I suppose this person expects everyone to use their unites on her. I don't mind using unites, but I doubt anyone will has that many to use continually.

Quite frankly, an uber under mid 40 laff will in fact go sad many times. All it takes is 2 unlured skels to send that toon back to admire the grass in Daisy's Garden. I remember when I had my uber at 25 laff, by some miracle I won the first 2 times (before the downgrade and unites), then I lost the next 5 before getting to the skel round. Since then, I've moved up to 44 laff and added another gag track and what a difference that has made. 7 wins and 1 loss since I made that move. However, my personal wins is not the reason I made that decision. I made it so that I could have more to offer the team as an uber. This is NOT a knock on the ubers that choose to stay at lower laffs, but a just a personal decision.

Every uber has a choice to make regarding laff. The lower the laff, the more dangerous it will be, and at the same time the more exciting and adventurous it will be. So, I suppose that every uber needs to find his/her own niche and comfort level. I've been at 25, 34, and now 44. Each laff level had its own exciting aura about it. At 44 laff, I expect to be able to make it to the pie fight a great majority of the time, whereas at 25 and 34, the expectation level was much more of a hope to get there.

At any rate, happy Ubering!

Pinkersmirk :

Here is a good example of what we are talking about. Here is a a comment I found on TTC by one of the new ubers.. I'm 22 laffs, cream pie and hose and I died a total of 5 V.P.'s.WUT DID I DO?!I'm..I'm...not cared for!!WAHH!!!Can some1 tell me something I could do?(besides laff boost that's all I can think of....)

YIKES! Sounds like this kid has a lot to learn about playing an uber. Even with perfect play from the rest of the team, luck plays such a major role for a toon that small. I realize that uber toons are the latest fad these days, but I think a lot of people building them lack the experience to be succesfull with them. Personally, I feel that before attempting to play an uber toon a person should have either a maxxed toon or at least a couple of toons with fairly high level Sell and Cash suits under their belt. Even with Little Igor having 34 laff, I usually go in to the VP knowing he has maybe a 50-50 chance of dancing. In all honesty, looking at some of the new toons that have been showing up for the runs lately, his chances are probably less. It seems there is always at least one toon who wants to use his shiny new ahooga horn on a row of lvl 10 and above cogs or his marbles on the new big cog that is coming out when the other big cogs are about to come unlured. And heaven forbid these 60 or 70 something laff toons take gag selection advice from a lowly 34 laffer.

Another thing, I don't think I would take a 2 gag uber into the VP until it had lvl 6 gags. I had originally planned on keeping Little Igor in hiding until he at least had his cake and storm, but Pink kinda called me out a little bit before he was ready.

Pinkersmirk :

Here is a good example of what we are talking about. Here is a a comment I found on TTC by one of the new ubers.. I'm 22 laffs, cream pie and hose and I died a total of 5 V.P.'s.WUT DID I DO?!I'm..I'm...not cared for!!WAHH!!!Can some1 tell me something I could do?(besides laff boost that's all I can think of....)

Yeah yeah! You were ready!! Just not sure anymore that those new to the CCG know how to play when sided with ubers. I was on the same side as a 113 the other day and we had a 25 laff and a mid laff on our side. Our first line up of cogs was a 12/6 and a couple of small cogs. She insisted on sounding them even though it left the 12 standing which everyone took a hit from. I was quick to annoucne I was going to use lure because I wasn't going to chance them sounding again. Not sure what is going on because this was a high laff new member. How hard is it to take the cogs out one at a time? I have been called "bossy" on my uber for telling high laffs what to do lol but I dont really care! If it keeps me from taking a quick trip back to the PG so be it..

I love the reaction I get when I know they will kill the cogs with their sound and choose to lure them in.. I have ran out of sound and tried to go for the cog I know will remain standing after they sound only to have the sound miss and the cogs come for me since my gag hit..

After the comment below it seems more and more to me that new ubers "expect" to win with us. I do my best to see that ubers on my side get throug.. Probably one of the reasons I usually have no unites because I jump to use them if needed. If they want a reality check they need to go try and play their uber on a random run. Chances are they wont even make it into the elevator. If they do make it to the VP they will most likely be griefed or sent to the PG with the way they play.. I am sure after a couple of random attempts they will really see how much we "take care" of them.

Like it was said before if you get tired of losing go up a few laff to see where you are comfortable playing at!

I never had intentions of making an uber with my Motor Mouse, but things happen. What Sir Igor says is so true. Luck is a major factor in wins with them. Having the skills to play is equally important, but if you have consistently missing lure, there isn't a whloe lot you can do.

Sir Igor :

Even with perfect play from the rest of the team, luck plays such a major role for a toon that small. I realize that uber toons are the latest fad these days, but I think a lot of people building them lack the experience to be succesfull with them.

I also agree with what he says here. I think of how BAD a player I was when I first started playing. I didn't have a clue about damge amounts, bonuses, nothing until my 13 y/o video game math wiz expert taught me a few things (I still have the sheet he wrote out telling me the amounts of damage needed to kill each level of cog). To know the strategies involved to play an uber takes some skill (knowing gag damage, bonus damages, lure bonuses, how to pass to save gags, etc...). I doubt newer players know enough to be able to play successfully. I sometimes am not sure what the best thing to do is and I have 2 big toons.

Sir Igor :

Personally, I feel that before attempting to play an uber toon a person should have either a maxxed toon or at least a couple of toons with fairly high level Sell and Cash suits under their belt. It seems there is always at least one toon who wants to use his shiny new ahooga horn on a row of lvl 10 and above cogs or his marbles on the new big cog that is coming out when the other big cogs are about to come unlured. And heaven forbid these 60 or 70 something laff toons take gag selection advice from a lowly 34 laffer.

I have to say too that I wonder what some of the bigger toons think when my 44 laff toon gives advice on how to play..

Yes Pink, that's the kind of ubers coming around lately. And the name uber is being stretched so far, that they say uber in training when they have squirting flowers still. This part gets to me the most, so many jump on the band wagon when who knows if they even have the stanima and patience to max gags at 34 lps (using my own lp as ex. ) Gag boosting isn't easy, it is a long very tough challenge in an ubers beginning. And I don't think you can even call yourself uber until you've proven you can stick to it on gag boosting. Next of course is they have not developed correct battle strategies. And this reminds me of Squeaky's post a little while ago on TTC, about the lure left, kill right, and what about killing the level 12 instead of the first cog in line to the right which is a level 4, or what if the first cog wakes up and the team should kill the 2nd cog who would then be next to wake, ect.
Toons I think of as ubers have mastered the battle by knowing already the best move beyond the lure left kill right game play. And Squeaky I'm not singling you out, just the thought's your post brought up. I think you do a great job in battle skill. Last uber VP I went to had a sf of a sf and the toon was new to uber vping. Right in the beginning I needed to start coaching on what move to do next. Thankfully they caught on to everything quick.
I wanted to mention Some Duck goes through different phases. The old Some Duck before I deleted her had the best luck, her lure rocked, her TU rocked, and she made it to her TM suit in one week or less doing randoms VPs. Some Duck this time around has an ok lure, great TU, and is not a lucky toon, lol. When she hit her TM suit she went sad in probably 8 back to back ccg VPs. Most because of failed lure, misses, not bad playing. I did start to not like all the saddness, but I'm glad I stuck with it because since that phrase things have moved along normally. She still goes sad, but she doesn't 8 times in a row. I could go on and on all day so I'll stop now. I'm thrilled we have a few new addition ubers from who I concider excellent players, like Loopy, BBubbles, Good Ol' Murky, Sir Igor to name a few. The others will I'm sure get over this fad soon until they have a better idea of what to do with such a special toon.

I've pretty much stopped vping on my 15 laffer for that exact reason. With so many Supers and "in trainings" theres just no room for Midge. I have to say I have 3 uberesqe toons and one normal toon. I won my first 2 vps on my 15 laffer with only level 4 gags. Once with sfs and once with randoms in the bus district. 0.0 He is 5/61 at this point but I'm starting to think with this new wave of nubers that it really is too risky for him. I was in a vp on m Junior yesterday, 75 laff wimpy gags, and got sided with Galloping Goose 15 laffs (level 5 throw and squirt.) , Crab E. Dawg 28 laffs (Sound Not Toon-up), And Hissy Fit 34 laffs Level 4 tu and lure level 6 throw and level 5 squirt. I realised it would be hard seeing as A.) Only me and hissy had tu. B). If I really needed a tu then we musta gotten hit badly, and all of them coulda been gone. Sadly, Goose went sad but we finished out that round. Then in skellies they split the only 4 toons with lure left and put Crab E. and 2 others lureless on the other side. Crab E. went sad but the other 2 lived thanks tolike 10 sos cards. The point i meant to make was i was going to ring my 15 laffer on this run. Luckily i didn't. But I just feel that Megoing sad, No matterwhat my gags are like is detrimental to the team so its a bad idea to vp him. I've seen like 10 posts on TTC from people saying that they are starting 15 laff supernoobs. I can't help but just continously laff at them. Because hey areasking how they should do it and what its like and saying yeah this is my first toon. Firstoff i had a 44 laff (sommewhat) Supernoob before my 15 laffer, so i knowthe levels andgag combos and stuff. The only other person i know to come close to winning on a 15 laffer other than me is Marshmallard's Galloping goose, and of course she knows what its like to be a supenoob. So i think Itshorrible f a 15 laffer is yourfirst supernoob whatsoever. but for it to be your first toon, Thats ridiculous. Same goes for 25 and 34 laffers, You ain alot having a regular toon before you make an Nubr.

Well said Salty! Great post from someone who has done the VP at the lowest laff possible!

Great posts by everyone! Always nice to see others' perspective on a topic such as this.

Ok, this is from the perspective of one of the newer "supers in training" on the block. I do understand where everyone is coming from, and as a proud member of the CCG I know better than to make any assumptions about winning VP on any of my toons, even my grown main toon. I'm also a bit like Pink in the fact that my unites are depleted many times because I do my best to help any ubers that I'm fighting the VP with. Neither of the ubers that I'm working on will see VP until I'm happy with their gags. For me, that's a minimum of 5th level across the board. I'm also making a concerted effort to keep my kids from using them at VP. The easiest way that I've found to accomplish this is to not have their suits started until I feel they're ready. As a matter of fact, my ubers have no friends list to speak of. Sure, at times it would be nice to be "escorted", but then I would not have the chance to learn the style of play necessary for an uber to increase their chances.

I did a good bit of research before I had started Little Furball Fuzzypounce, and found that I did even more before I even got to the creation stage of my super. I was even one of the people that asked questions of current supers and ubers. Albeit, I wasn't looking for easy answers or a quick path or even "how the heck do I make one of those crazy uber thingamajiggers", but we all stand on the shoulders of giants (no matter how small those giants are).

The ubers that I have been around during my beginnings in the CCG I still consider to be some of the finest players in the game. I have been fortunate enough to learn a great deal from these wonderful players. That's probably why I am so critical of my own ubers. I don't want to be one of those players that brings out what is quickly becoming the uber-chic standard of the day. I want my toons - no matter what level laff - to be welcomed into a party because they are able to make a positive contribution, not just because they are MY toons.

Just my two cents. Questions and comments always welcome.